T56 magnum in 2nd Gen with DSE subframe

[Alponcho]

Actually was referring to the crossmember in badazz81z28's pics.

[badazz81z28]

Thanks for posting the pics. Is that the 67-69 crossmember, and did you have to modify it in any way?

Wondering if there are benefits to the DSE weld-in crossmember? It's a much more expensive route, but maybe itadds stiffness to the floor and benefits exhaust clearance?

Kind of, Bowler made it specific for my 70 Camaro based on their 67-69 crossmember. It's the same width, but there is more set-back.

[Craig@Bowler]

I've decided to stick to my original plan and go with the T56…was considering options to save time and to delay having to spend $$$ and there are merits to an automatic, but I may as well do it right…the car is a shell so the tunnel mod isn't really a big deal.

I guess I'll need to get some prices on a close ratio unit, bell housing, hydraulic clutch set up, flywheel, cross member, etc., so that I can get everything mocked up…nice that the IAII block has dual bolt pattern (pontiac and chevy/corporate). Wondering if there's a tested/proven combo of parts that will work?

Whenever you're ready, let me know what your torque output is and how you will be using the car and we can put together a quote on a kit that will be best suited for you and your car.

[Alponcho]

The T56, BH, clutch, crossmember, etc., arrived on Tuesday. Thanks Craig.

[Craig@Bowler]

The T56, BH, clutch, crossmember, etc., arrived on Tuesday. Thanks Craig.

You're welcome! Thank you for your trust in our company.

[Alponcho]

Attachment 125615Attachment 125616I have Marks crossmember and DSE frame and all I cut was the hole for the shifter plus a few inches forward. Up near the front I just massaged the floor pan.

I bought one of these cross members, but I'm not sure it fits. Did you have to massage the floor to the insides of the mounting points?

[badazz81z28]

I bought one of these cross members, but I'm not sure it fits. Did you have to massage the floor to the insides of the mounting points?

No, it touches the floor but no massaging. Are you using solid body bushings? If you're using rubber bushings, that could be your problem.

[Alponcho]

No, it touches the floor but no massaging. Are you using solid body bushings? If you're using rubber bushings, that could be your problem.

I'm using solid, standard height body bushings. It seems like the bar is a good 1/2" too tall (maybe a bit more) in area where it traverses the floor. Did you have to wedge yours in place on one side and push up to make it work? Not sure I can do that in my situation. It looks like I'll have to cut the floor, or flat plane the top of the crossmember to make it fit.

[Alponcho]

Does anyone know if the second gen Firebird body mounts are a different height than the second gen Camaro? I bought my body mounts from DSE and I just noticed that the catalog states that the body mounts are for "Camaro Only". This might explain why I'm having difficulty with the cross member.

[badazz81z28]

Does anyone know if the second gen Firebird body mounts are a different height than the second gen Camaro? I bought my body mounts from DSE and I just noticed that the catalog states that the body mounts are for "Camaro Only". This might explain why I'm having difficulty with the cross member.

Not sure if they even have the same floor. I Know mine wasn't a easy slip in to fit, but it went in.

[Doug1]

I put the T-56 in my Trans Am with an IA2 535 motor. I run DSE 1/2 height mounts and a Quadra-link on the back. Here's a link to the build...
http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=51065

I spoke with Stacy at DSE and she said that they mod the tunnel on all T-56 2nd gens. You can stuff it in there without doing so but your driveline angles will not be correct. You can see that I raised mine about 2" and then dropped it off right at the tail end of the transmission. I cut out the tunnel and got the drive angles right and then built the new tunnel to fit the correct alignment.

And to get my crossmember in, I did have to massage the floor with a BFH. I put a 74 floor in the car since that was the only entire floorpan I could order.

[Alponcho]

I put the T-56 in my Trans Am with an IA2 535 motor. I run DSE 1/2 height mounts and a Quadra-link on the back. Here's a link to the build...
http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=51065

I spoke with Stacy at DSE and she said that they mod the tunnel on all T-56 2nd gens. You can stuff it in there without doing so but your driveline angles will not be correct. You can see that I raised mine about 2" and then dropped it off right at the tail end of the transmission. I cut out the tunnel and got the drive angles right and then built the new tunnel to fit the correct alignment.

And to get my crossmember in, I did have to massage the floor with a BFH. I put a 74 floor in the car since that was the only entire floorpan I could order.

It looks like the transmission might fit with some enlargement of the shifter hole and some hammering near the front like Badazz described...though I still have not gotten the crossmember situation figured out or checked the driveline angles. I need to take some pics of the cross member and send to Craig to see what's going on

Also dealing with a couple other issues...for example, I need to shim up the DSE Pontiac engine brackets 1/4" so I can bolt up the motor mounts. I need to decide which side I should shim, or maybe both?

[Doug1]

If you must shim, I'd do both. Particularly if you plan to run a shaker. The shaker adds a whole new level of complexity in getting the engine in their just right. Of course a drop base shaker is required in the vast majority of cases but how much drop changes from car to car with the manifold being the biggest deciding factor.

[Alponcho]

If you must shim, I'd do both. Particularly if you plan to run a shaker. The shaker adds a whole new level of complexity in getting the engine in their just right. Of course a drop base shaker is required in the vast majority of cases but how much drop changes from car to car with the manifold being the biggest deciding factor.

Thanks, I didn't think of that issue. I plan to use a Formula hood, which of course will present similar challenges if I decide to use a factory style Ram Air set-up. In addition to the DSE subframe and engine mounts which which pushed everything back 1.5" I had to find a low profile intake that would fit without robbing too much power. I have a friend here in Scottsdale that came up with something that should work well. He tested it against other options and it doesn't give much up. What's the point of having 535ci if you can't use all of it!

[badazz81z28]

DSE raises the tunnel for a cleaner install. If you do what I did, the shifter sticks above the floor as you can see in my pics, if you fully cut you can make it above and more smooth. My trans angle downward is the same as DSEs car

[Alponcho]

Spoke with Craig who sold me the crossmember. He said they were designed to fit a 3" exhaust so they would be tight. Anyways, not sure I can get enough clearance using a hammer on the floor. Might have to cut the floor. I guess another option would be to slice the crossmember along the top and then top plate it.

[badazz81z28]

It is snug, but it will fit. Slide it in from the back some, not angle it up there like in your pic. Also Try installing just the crossmember and then lift the trans and slide the trans mount in.

[Alponcho]

Turned out that we needed more room in the tunnel after all. Ended up adjusting the floor with a wooden block and a floor jack. Plenty of room now. Crossmember fit right in after that. Nice piece.

[Craig@Bowler]

Looks really good! Those are some great pics too. It's always helpful for use to see as many of these installs as we can. So many times cars of the same group can be so different from one another.