Project 1970 ZL1 chevelle

[soulsurfer702]

Hi new to the forum and just was seeing if i could get some advice as far as my project 70 chevelle is going. I just had the car swapped over to a 2015 ZL1 camaro dropout as far as the engine bay is setup. Now i am on the fence as far as which route i should go the suspension. Ive been comparing mainly the Hotchkis level 2 coil over kit vs a ride tech air ride kit. The car is going to be a daily driver during the week for me on the streets of las vegas. I know the obvious answer is to go with air ride but still not trying to go too overboard on the car budget, as the air ride kit is about 6800 with all the hardware plus installation vs the Hotchkis coilover street kit which is about a 1/2 the price. The car is heading over to paint shop this month so i still have a bit to decide. But i was hoping you guys could give me some imput as far as best bang for my buck for the suspension setup for my 70 chevelle. Thanks!

Paul

[soulsurfer702]

Pictures

[dhutton]

For an A body that will be street driven I recommend ATS spindles with SPC arms, SPC Springs, and Bilstein shocks. Hellwig sway bars, Currie rear arms. I had this set up on my GTO and the ride was awesome. Not harsh at all.

Mark at SC&C can set you up.

Don

[raustinss]

Yep see Mark as suggested above or tony at abc performance ,Tony 's chevelle is probably the fastest cone killing chevelle in the u.s.
As for the engine swap ive heard good things about the gm connect and cruise kits , holley has decent swap stuff as does speedtech, who also have nice suspension stuff

[1sikride]

Check out one or ridetechs kits.

Viking is also another wicked suspension
Brand.

And ya. Air ride is overkill.

What else do u have planned???

[ra11ysport]

Yeah! RideTech all the way for me. If I’m running a stock frame then it’s ridetech for sure.

[USAZR1]

Been there, done that with a full-blown air ride system. Would never do it, again.

[soulsurfer702]

As far as the guys saying to stay away from the air ride setup why is that? Just cause its over prices or because of ride quality? I talked to both the guys from ride tech, for the air ride, and hotchkis for their coilover and stret grip setup. Both said that the coilover setup is a stiffer ride and that air ride is a better over all ride but just way more expensive. So still up in the air right now but would love to hear what you guys have to say. Will be running american racing 17x9 wheels in the front and 17x10 in the rear of the car. Planning on keeping the interior pretty much stock

[raustinss]

actually id love to watch this unfold too... tell us usazr1 why are you oppose to air

[Marcus SC&C]

Paul, the most important thing at this stage is to do your research before you start throwing money at things. You know what you want to use the car for (daily driver), so start selecting components based on that goal. In other words select parts suited to make your car the best daily driver it can be. Some parts are really well suited to auto cross and track days, some are designed to work best for drag racing, these parts will be poor choices for your application (daily driver). Keep your eye on the ball, don`t be distracted by cool looking, shiny objects. Brand names, ad hype and who seems cool or not mean nothing.
Let`s look at what you have to start with first. You have a cool looking vintage car with a full frame. The frame is weak in torsion and lacks triangulation so that`s something to consider but it`s nowhere near the weakest link in the chain so we can bypass it for now. Looking at the suspension front we see some big red flags pop up right away. The front suspension has completely backward camber curves, underground roll center that`s wildly unstable and a massive amount of bump steer. The stock alignment range is unable to run modern alignment settings. So, now you decide how to handle this grim news. You can either A) ignore all these problems and try to tune around them (dumb) or 2) correct the problems and tune the car like a modern properly designed car (smart!). We`ll assume you`re smart and proceed down that path. :razz: Correcting the front end geometry on this car means relocating suspension pickup points (pivot points) vertically to better locations. That means a *properly engineered* tall spindle or tall ball joint package. There are LOTS of tall spindles out there, a few of them are good. We originated the concept of using tall ball joints to correct geometry on these cars over 15 years ago and sell properly integrated packages using them. In recent years tall ball joints have become more widely available and they are often misapplied and misused, causing new problems. In other words, don`t try to cobble something together and do your research before you buy! If you do this step correctly the improvement is night and day! The car will both handle and drive worlds better, and you haven`t even started tuning the rest of the chassis yet. Our Stage 2-Plus package and StreetComp-AFX package are great examples for this phase of the build. Now is also the time to consider tubular lower A arms. They can add a lot of strength and rigidity to the system and some like the SPC Performance lowers can also add features like adjustable ride height and added tire clearance at higher caster settings.
Next up we`re tuning the chassis with springs and shocks. The most long term reliable and trouble free system for a daily driver Chevelle is conventional coil springs and separate shocks. It`s the OE format for a good reasons. It`s got the most available spring travel, no coil binding issues and we`re not holding up the entire car with a few little shock bushings. That`s fine for racing or a weekend toy but not ideal for long term daily use. For the record I have nothing against coil overs per se (we work with them all the time) but we prefer to use them when they are the best tool for the job at hand and daily driver isn`t it. Select a touring rate set of springs with a sensible amount of drop to retain adequate bump travel. Most of our kits use SPC Performance springs but Global West, Hotchkiss, Eibach etc. all make good (and very similar) options. Stay away from super low show car springs for a daily driver. The car will look wicked cool but drive poorly and bottom out a lot, making you hate life. :doh: For shocks you don`t care what label is on them, you care what the actual rates and dampening curves are and how well suited they are to YOUR application. Ideally you want shocks that are long term reliable with dirt and moisture seals (that leaves out many otherwise good racing shocks), you want digressive valving if you can get it and you wants shocks with a generous amount of rebound dampening. Many of the shocks sold for these cars are very old designs, some even predating your car! You`re not going to build a really good daily driver with shocks from the 1970s or with circle track shocks or with auto cross shocks or with drag race shocks. Some double adjustable shocks may have enough adjustment range to cover all the bases but most do not. Research shocks, learn what makes them tick and study the shock dyno sheets for the shocks available before you buy, or just buy them from someone who understands shocks and what you really need. We work with many brands of shocks daily but for your application I like the Varishock SS or QS2 best.
I just realized how long this post is getting, OMG I`m practically rewriting my book! So quickly, your next steps are selecting the right rear trailing arms and front and rear sway bars. The devil is in the details with both of these, they are not all created equally! But I`ve gone on too much already. Please feel free to give us a call and take advantage of our Free Suspension Counseling Service for more detailed information. If you`re into learning about this stuff you can pick up a copy of How to Make Your Muscle Car Handle. Last but not least if you don`t want to go through all this thinking we have complete packages on our site that we can tailor to your needs. I`ll shut up now. :) Mark SC&C

[USAZR1]

actually id love to watch this unfold too... tell us usazr1 why are you oppose to air


For what I spent on the complete set-up from ART (now Ridetech), I could have bought the best coilovers and had money left over. ART's digital sensors were so inaccurate back then that they swapped them out for their analog set-up, at no charge. That and constantly having to adjust the ride heights, at each corner, and losing air on the right front driving down the interstate at 75mph. (quite a smoke show). I'm sure Ridetech has improved their air ride considerably since then but you can say the same about coilovers,too.
Now, let's hear your opinion about air ride, raustinss.


Mark, thanks for your input.

[968ls1]

Go with Mark at SC&C he knows his stuff and will sell you a system that works at a great value.

[raustinss]

have a couple friends who have air ...t bird super coupe and a third gen firebird ...me personally I would never run air for damn near the reason you stated . I believe the cost and or the trouble that come with it aren't worth it . This is just my 2 cent opinion .

[USAZR1]

Yep, different strokes for different folks. Speaking only for myself, I'm going to stay away from coilovers and air ride, on this car. Instead, the plan is to stay with conventional coil springs and quality shocks, as Mark Savitske suggested.

[AU Doc]

Mark is a great guy to work with! I replaced the entire suspension on my camaro with A package Mark put together for me. I don’t have a lot of miles on the car yet, but there’s no question it’s a night and day difference. I highly recommend you give him a call and talk over your options.

[killer69]

YOU should get in your car and drive to St George an check out our Abody suspension kit.

http://www.speedtechperformance.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=results/category_id=76/mode=cat/cat76.htm

LOTS of different options. i cna put you in touch with our local customer who has our stuff and has done 4 Goodguys road tours, actually he just drove his car from Bowling Green to DSE then the road tour to GG Texas then home to St George. he competes in the Optima events, and GG Auto X as well.

this is his Car

http://www.speedtechperformance.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=395/category_id=7/mode=prod/prd395.htm

[soulsurfer702]

Alright guys after consulting with a couple pro touring setup 70 chevelle guys in town, one of which is running the same ZL1 setup i am, I'm going with Ride Tech air ride, along with running big front and rear sway bars along with frame reinforcement. Really excited to get all this installed and see how the combo ends up performing. Now is the time to decide on wheels. I know forgeline is a huge name in the industry and really like a couple of their wheels but not looking to run a big wheel Was thinking 17x10 in the front and 18x11 in the rear. I also really dig some of the Rushforth wheels as well, they have a really aggressive look on them even when they aren't a huge wheel. Any input from you guys would help out a ton, going to take a couple weeks to decide on the wheels while the suspension is being installed over at the shop.

Paul
1970 ZL chevelle

[dhutton]

Alright guys after consulting with a couple pro touring setup 70 chevelle guys in town, one of which is running the same ZL1 setup i am, I'm going with Ride Tech air ride, along with running big front and rear sway bars along with frame reinforcement. Really excited to get all this installed and see how the combo ends up performing. Now is the time to decide on wheels. I know forgeline is a huge name in the industry and really like a couple of their wheels but not looking to run a big wheel Was thinking 17x10 in the front and 18x11 in the rear. I also really dig some of the Rushforth wheels as well, they have a really aggressive look on them even when they aren't a huge wheel. Any input from you guys would help out a ton, going to take a couple weeks to decide on the wheels while the suspension is being installed over at the shop.

Paul
1970 ZL chevelle

I recommend you check tire availability before going 17/18.

Don

[soulsurfer702]

Don,

Ive heard a couple times that i should be looking at 18" and up cause of tire selection. Is there really that much less of a selection from 17" to 18"?? If so looks like i will just run 18x9.5 and 18x11. Thanks!!!

[dhutton]

Don,

Ive heard a couple times that i should be looking at 18" and up cause of tire selection. Is there really that much less of a selection from 17" to 18"?? If so looks like i will just run 18x9.5 and 18x11. Thanks!!!

Yes there is and it will likely be tougher to go 17/18 versus 17. But don’t believe me, spend some time in tirerack.com doing some research.

Don

[USAZR1]

,,,,,,,,

[soulsurfer702]

Ok. Doing 18x9.5 up front and 18x11 in the rear. Anyone have any preference when it comes to a good wheel? I am leaning towards a set up either Rushforth, Boze or Forgelines. Would love a custom set of forgelines but trying to keep the wheels about 3k since i went crazy on the rest of the build

[soulsurfer702]

Thanks for the advice Don! You were definitely right so i ended up doing a set of the Rusthforth X Rated wheels in polished steel. Did 18x9 in the front and 18x11 in rear.

[csouth]

Thanks for the advice Don! You were definitely right so i ended up doing a set of the Rusthforth X Rated wheels in polished steel. Did 18x9 in the front and 18x11 in rear.

Nice choice, although you probably meant polished Billet... :razz:

[TheJDMan]

Just to point out, Ridetech does sell coilover systems as well.